Next Album Rumours Thread IV - 2 Sing 2 Furious

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I really like ATYCLB but there was always a bit of me which was disappointed they'd seemingly given up with the experimentation of the previous phase. Given how they got burned with Pop, I guess that's not surprising, but for me, Achtung Baby, Zooropa, Passengers & Pop (with Zoo TV and PopMart) was by far the most exciting period of their music for me.

My biggest disappointment in post-Pop land is that from what we know, they appeared to have a crisis of confidence with the direction of NLOTH and it got watered down. The stories about the Fez sessions and what they were doing really got me excited, but the end result was a letdown. Maybe I'd built it up in to something it was never going to be.

For all their faults, I still think they're making much better original music than we have any real right to expect from a band who've been together for as long as they have.

I'm very much somebody who advocates for the experimental side of U2, and that's seen in my dismay that they would follow the advice of idiots like their manager Guy Oseary (who I wouldn't be surprised if he has influenced them with diabolical creative decisions), Ryan Tedder, and god knows what other awful MOR producers they've worked with to ruin their albums.

But ATYCLB was a refreshing change from the experimentalism of the 90s which for that style had probably run its course anyhow (I love everything they released in the 90s, but I'm not sure where else they could have gone with it), and the brightness of it contrasts well with what went before. I can also forgive them for Atomic Bomb and trying to create a conventional and direct rock record.

But my patience wore thin for No Line - as you say, the time for experimentalism had arrived once more, the Fez sessions with Eno/Lanois sounded exciting with the prospect of 'future hymns' and 'futuristic spirituals', influenced by traditional music....... and then they bottled it spectacularly.

Fragments remain here and there on the album, but ever since then, they've been frozen with fear in doing anything remotely interesting musically. They've never had a big idea for an album since.
 
I'm very much somebody who advocates for the experimental side of U2, and that's seen in my dismay that they would follow the advice of idiots like their manager Guy Oseary (who I wouldn't be surprised if he has influenced them with diabolical creative decisions), Ryan Tedder, and god knows what other awful MOR producers they've worked with to ruin their albums.

But ATYCLB was a refreshing change from the experimentalism of the 90s which for that style had probably run its course anyhow (I love everything they released in the 90s, but I'm not sure where else they could have gone with it), and the brightness of it contrasts well with what went before. I can also forgive them for Atomic Bomb and trying to create a conventional and direct rock record.

But my patience wore thin for No Line - as you say, the time for experimentalism had arrived once more, the Fez sessions with Eno/Lanois sounded exciting with the prospect of 'future hymns' and 'futuristic spirituals', influenced by traditional music....... and then they bottled it spectacularly.

Fragments remain here and there on the album, but ever since then, they've been frozen with fear in doing anything remotely interesting musically. They've never had a big idea for an album since.

Remember the little clips they were releasing before NLOTH came out? They sounded so promising and also there is a YouTube video of the recording sessions from the NLOTH days and some of those songs sounded like they could have been so amazing! It was a bit of a downer that a lot of that stuff didn’t make the album. I remember there was a short clip released of some amazing guitar riff that Ofcourse never made the album. I wonder if these clips are still available somewhere on the net.
 
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For all their faults, I still think they're making much better original music than we have any real right to expect from a band who've been together for as long as they have.


Definitely this. I hope their next album is somehow the start of a new era. Aside from NLOTH, post-Pop U2 has been awfully self-referential/meta, what with the back to basics this, and Songs of… that. It would do them well to look forward again, which doesn’t mean experimental necessarily. Whatever it ends up as, I’m sure it’ll be better than good, hopefully great.
 
I fully agree. It's not perfect but the sentiments are felt for me as Bono lets the music breathe. The Edge's composition, helped by Eno & Lanois's production, is beautifully subtle and meticulously crafted in a way that The Edge has never been since. Its minimalistic style counterpoints the big early songs of the album perfectly and is an ideal closer.

Indeed, Peace On Earth, New York and Grace all work because of their minimalism, really driving the point home of this album being a thoughtful and sincere album.

The album gets ever more contemplative and quiet, which I love that about All That You Can't Leave Behind. It really feels like a complete album as a result and you can a satisfying calming 'vibe' from it.

Latter U2 would make an absolute mess of this, being all over the place with its vibe, and dumping minimalism in favour of ugly bombast.

The album beats every U2 mess that was released after to a pulp .

I’m starting to wonder if you’ve ever really listened to SOI or SOE. Leave American Soul and sort of Love is bigger aside. Where is the ugly bombast? Both album closers are spare and meditative and lyrically and vocally superior to Grace.

If you listen to the tracklisting i posted earlier, the songs from SOE actually are the more calm, pretty and soothing songs, with also a shadow of sadness and acceptance that carries through which definitely moves me more than the songs on All That.
I hear ‘Songs of’ haters always say that Bono just is a string of cliches now. But I find that to be pretty non existent on SOI and occasional on SOE (looking at you again American Soul). But Grace is pretty much completely that. Start to merciful finish.
 
I’m starting to wonder if you’ve ever really listened to SOI or SOE. Leave American Soul and sort of Love is bigger aside. Where is the ugly bombast? Both album closers are spare and meditative and lyrically and vocally superior to Grace.



If you listen to the tracklisting i posted earlier, the songs from SOE actually are the more calm, pretty and soothing songs, with also a shadow of sadness and acceptance that carries through which definitely moves me more than the songs on All That.

I hear ‘Songs of’ haters always say that Bono just is a string of cliches now. But I find that to be pretty non existent on SOI and occasional on SOE (looking at you again American Soul). But Grace is pretty much completely that. Start to merciful finish.
Spot on,but it seems to be cool to bash the later albums. Just look at the NME reviews,just a complete joke. In my opinion SOI overall is a stronger album than ATYCLB,and bomb is better than both.

Better get my tin hat on!
 
Can we just agree that When I Look at The World is their greatest post Pop song?

It is one of their last songs defined by an Edge soundscape.

I would say "one of their best".

It's a great tune, but there are some other ones:

- No Line On The Horizon
- City Of Blinding Lights
- Fez _ Being Porn
- This Is Where You Can Reach Me Now
- Iris
- The Little Things That Give You Away
- The Blackout
 
I am far from the most optimistic person in the world. Who the hell can be these days? LMAO! Whether it's my personal life or the state of the world- I find plenty to worry about. As for U2, I find more than enough to be critical of. I'm not one of those "everything they've done is gold" fan boys.

That being said, I have a really hard time reading so much of the ridiculous, predictable takes of anything U2 these days. Here and elsewhere. I remember saying to myself this time last week that I'd see a headline just like the "worst song of the year" bullshit that was written in Pitchfork. The predictability is what kills me! Not to mention, this idiot likely did not hear the song before writing that review. So much of it is motivated by personal animosity toward Bono, which I'll never understand. Do I shed any tears for him? Of course not, I think he's just fine in life. But I don't think there's a more misunderstood person the last 15 years than Bono. If this man just cared about his ego, he'd have some restaurants or a TV show or some other shit- he would not be doing all this political work (like or agree with it or not) on his own time and with his own money.

As for the song itself..... it's nothing great, but I wasn't expecting it to be. It's also nowhere near as bad as people are saying here or elsewhere! I actually think it's bordering on good. A few people have pointed out there's a little more space here than we've seen in a while- not so much jamming lyrics into every inch of the song. It also has a mature, reflective, lounge type vibe to it. Others here have also alluded to this and mentioned how easy it would've been to make a full play at the kid/pop sound. The first verse even reminds me of "Stay" or "Ground beneath..." even though the song is obviously nowhere near as good as either of those.

It is a FINE song for what it is. And to the Pitchfork asshole and anyone else saying this is somehow conceited or insincere or implying that U2 (Bono) has saved all these lives, I'd ask for a simple google search of what Bono has been up to since the pandemic. He's been writing all about songs FROM OTHER ARTISTS, NOT HIMSELF, that have " saved his life. " So to say that this isn't sincere or whatever is ridiculous and can be debunked by the most minimal research effort. It's absolutely inexcusable for a music writer at a publication with editors to be writing that utter bullshit unless the goal is just a personal hit piece for clicks. Let's see it for what it is......

And I've had enough of people saying that material they don't like means it's insincere or a cynical play for the charts in general. Yeah, like most people here, I have no idea what they ever saw in Get out of your own way. However, I realize that it fits with what Bono had been saying, thinking, etc in that time in his life. I'm still flabbergasted that the band who put out anything 1987-1993 couldn't find a better lyrical or musical way to express it, but I'd never say the thought behind it is insincere.

Do I have any idea why Boots or SUC ever saw the light of day, never mind an album? No. Would either wind up anywhere near TUF, War, Boy or even Pop? Of course not. Notice I didn't mention JT or AB because I'm not holding them to the standard of 2 of the best albums ever released by any musical act, period. Nor would I claim that post-2000 beats 1980-2000- because again, you're talking one of the best runs of any artists ever! But to claim that "everything since sucks and this is just the latest low point" flies in the face of any reasonable examination of the material.

To each their own, but I don't see how a U2 fan from the beginning could really think Invisible, Crystal Ballroom, Raised by wolves, Cedarwood rd, The Troubles, Little Things, Red Flag Day, etc are so out of whack quality wise that they can't hold a candle to what came before. I could do the same thing with ATYCLB, BOMB and NLOTH but you all get the idea.

For what it's worth, I actually liked "We are the people" a lot. On its face and for what it was. We just came out of the worst year plus of our collective lives!! What is wrong with a blatant attempt at joy and celebration?! The DJ collobaration?? They're going for the kidzzzzzzzzzz!!!!!!????? Save it!! I often wonder what the reaction would've been if this place existed when they started working with Oakenfeld on the AB remixes!

Along those same lines, what is wrong with telling people that "saved" or seriously impacted our lives as much?! The idea behind that? It's insincere and "Hallmark?" Or is it maybe a 60 year old man with wisdom and life experience (including two recent brushes with death) is pleading with us to 1) slow down and recognize the people who keep you going and 2) maybe let them know because life is short?

Will I listen to it in 5 years? No. Listen to it on purpose again? Maybe 2 or 3 times. Hell, to me it isn't even "Love is bigger" level good and is nowhere near as good as "Ordinary Love" which I thought was an excellent one-off that showed signs of good things to come! I just wish the criticisms were fairer and better thought out.

Maybe I'm in a different place than most in my thinking, but I really do feel that if you've experienced difficulty in life- especially loss/grief and/or mental health issues, you get what the hell Bono has been saying since SOI (California, Little Things, Showman, Blackout, Love is bigger most especially). If you haven't, you're less likely to.

Hell, my Mom just lost her boss who was very close to her today. He saved her job and with it, our house and pretty much my life as I know it by going to bat for her in 2011. I was too wrapped up in my own issues to know it at the time, but today, when he's gone, is the first time I've truly reflected on and appreciated him.

Well, I can't write a song that winds up in a movie and gets slammed all over Pitchfork and elsewhere (maybe for good reason in some places, who the hell knows?) but maybe it would be nice if we could be aware of the fact that people "save" our lives in many ways throughout them and be lucky enough to be able to tell them as much in time!

I'm at the point where I'm viewing everything we get from U2 as a bonus. They don't need to prove shit to me or anyone else anymore. The live shows still blow away everyone I know that sees them for the first time. And they're U2's shows that they headline in the biggest venues in the world. I'd take that over being on a quadruple bill with 3 other washed up 80s acts at your half-full local ampitheatre.

They step in it more than they used to and more than the acts that just lean on the past, but I'll take the trade off any day to keep them around at this level.

Top Darts!
 
Can we just agree that When I Look at The World is their greatest post Pop song?

It is one of their last songs defined by an Edge soundscape.

It's the best one on that album, at least.

And like other penultimate tracks that were their album's best, Acrobat and This Is Where, they weren't played live on their corresponding tours. Acrobat I understand due to its moodiness and unconventional time signature, but considering This Is Where was originally meant to be the album opener, it boggles the mind. And it's a legitimately danceable track.
 
I would say "one of their best".

It's a great tune, but there are some other ones:

- No Line On The Horizon
- City Of Blinding Lights
- Fez _ Being Porn
- This Is Where You Can Reach Me Now
- Iris
- The Little Things That Give You Away
- The Blackout

Yeah, When I Look, is a really good song, and Edge is great on it.

I definitely wouldn't say their best post-POP song. But a good one.

I like your list here.

I'm not sure on LIttle Things or Blackout,

But I would add to the very top of the list - Sleep Like a Baby Tonight and Magnificent.
 
Iris has a good arrangement on the verses but that Chris Martin shit on the chorus is painful.

Replace with The Troubles.



Question: do you also make that same Chris Martin argument about City of Blinding Lights? Because, like, same thing.
 
I don’t see a point in engaging his obviously offended view of Coldplay - it’s an outdated and comical attempt at being 2010-stylish.
 
Bring back 90s fashion:

images
 
I don’t see a point in engaging his obviously offended view of Coldplay - it’s an outdated and comical attempt at being 2010-stylish.

I didn’t know that strongly disliking a band was somehow a trend. And I was on the outs with these guys going back to their second album, but nice try, I guess.
 
Coldplay has been alternating between shitty and really good albums going back to X&Y. I don't know how I feel about them, other than they're compromised and inconsistent.
 
I didn’t know that strongly disliking a band was somehow a trend. And I was on the outs with these guys going back to their second album, but nice try, I guess.



So do you also shit on the chorus of City of Blinding Lights for the very similar falsetto vocals that appear on Iris? I don’t recall that being the case, but maybe it has been.
 
Question: do you also make that same Chris Martin argument about City of Blinding Lights? Because, like, same thing.

So do you also shit on the chorus of City of Blinding Lights for the very similar falsetto vocals that appear on Iris? I don’t recall that being the case, but maybe it has been.

They may have something in common, but one is executed far better than the other. These also aren't the only two songs with Bono wailing, either. And Chris Martin is literally performing on only one of these tracks.
 
They may have something in common, but one is executed far better than the other. These also aren't the only two songs with Bono wailing, either. And Chris Martin is literally performing on only one of these tracks.



Oh I see. The “oooh” on Iris is almost identical in every way to the “oooh” on City of Blinding Lights, but since Chris Martin isn’t on City of Blinding Lights it’s awesome and since he is on Iris it’s shit. The content doesn’t really matter to you. Just the hatred of Chris Martin.

Edit: actually wait. Did Chris Martin perform on Iris? I’ll admit I don’t follow U2 as closely as I used to, but I can’t find anything referencing it.
 
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This little exchange made me go down a decade worth of posts just to remind myself what everyone else was like about coldplay then. And from there I ended up doing a historical search of the term “butthurt” because I think the term is awfully dated and it was used in one of the coldplay threads. Then idk how but I ended up on all sorts of threads like Wikipedia chain reading.

Since I can’t sleep, here are the notes!

- everyone thought Donald Trump was a nutjob and an asshole in 2015. Many Trumpster converts since then. A few who celebrated the Supreme Court ruling on SSM.
- web forums were far more hostile back then
- there was (and still is) a clique here… back-up most certainly arrived for one side, even if the view was morally on the wrong side, but as time went along the back-up thing stopped happening as much
- we need deep back
- though you didn’t need the reminder, there’s U2 fan fiction out there
- laz was cool about coldplay before it was cool to to be cool about coldplay
 
This little exchange made me go down a decade worth of posts just to remind myself what everyone else was like about coldplay then. And from there I ended up doing a historical search of the term “butthurt” because I think the term is awfully dated and it was used in one of the coldplay threads. Then idk how but I ended up on all sorts of threads like Wikipedia chain reading.

Since I can’t sleep, here are the notes!

- everyone thought Donald Trump was a nutjob and an asshole in 2015. Many Trumpster converts since then. A few who celebrated the Supreme Court ruling on SSM.
- web forums were far more hostile back then
- there was (and still is) a clique here… back-up most certainly arrived for one side, even if the view was morally on the wrong side, but as time went along the back-up thing stopped happening as much
- we need deep back
- though you didn’t need the reminder, there’s U2 fan fiction out there
- laz was cool about coldplay before it was cool to to be cool about coldplay

Forums are fun. I think in this structure, if anything, there's just a greater chance of being ganged up on in a way that wouldn't happen in person.

I made a comment here, gosh, like 10 years ago that I just didn't word well and I got ganged up on pretty bad where I just said "fuck it" and left for a year. I know it's happened to others too. That's just forums for you.
 
That's just forums for you.

Yea, last spring I re-joined the most active NIN fan-forum because I scored tickets to the two Cleveland shows that never happened. I was stoked! Shortly thereafter, the NIN/Halsey album was announced and all of these deeply hateful comments started pouring in and I had to bail again. Despite a less-vocal faction of similarly minded fans, the misogyny and gatekeeping was even worse than it was when I stopped going to this forum around the turn of the decade for similar reasons.

Forums are double-edged swords, as all echo chambers are.
 
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I think we’re a fairly diverse forum here. Hearing other people’s view on certain U2 albums has helped me to take deeper listens and appreciate things I hadn’t before. Helped me to discover new cool music. Politics is politics, so not really worth the breath.

only thing that really annoys me are people that swop in after years of absence just to say how shitty U2 is with statements that don’t hold any water.
 
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